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Around SBN: Will Rhymes 'Fine' After Being Hit By Pitch And Fainting

The Unbearable Lightness of McBean

PIRRI!  DID YOU EAT YOUR CHUNKY SOUP?!. (Photo by Claus Andersen/Getty Images)

Sorry about the Kundera reference, but the plight of skinny hockey players like Wayne McBean swung too phonetically close to leave it alone.  The thing is, McBean came into the league floating on high expectations, but when it came to the bigs he really never fit the demands of playing defense at a high level.  Maybe you can't chalk it up entirely to his size, but weighing 185 pounds (~84 kg) at 6'2" (1.88 m) was not exactly going to prepare him for an NHL that shifted towards forwards like Eric Lindros.  

A player like McBean made me think a bit about contemporary skinny players and what might be distinct about them.  Are they exclusively younger players?  Skilled players?  How many of them were defensemen?  How many are skinnier than Wayne McBean?  These things can get out of control quickly.

Star-divide

I figured the best way to go about this is to present height and weight (in that order) as a ratio.  League-wide, the average height this year is just a little over 6'1" (1.85 m), and the weight a bit over 204 pounds (~93 kg), for a McBean ratio of .3584.  True McBean was at .4.  The highest ratio in the league was .45; the lowest was .298.

I took all my data from hockey-reference.com, and this is out of 672 skaters.  I left goalies out because Ryan Miller would be like a 1.0 and Martin Brodeur would be around .000000001 and I didn't want that to fudge my beloved ratio.

Highest McBean Ratios (Skinny), Top 25 2010-11

Brandon Pirri --- .45

T.J. Brodie --- .4294

Michael Grabner --- .4235

Tyler Ennis --- .4233

Steve Sullivan --- .4224

Oliver Ekman-Larsson --- .4205

Alexander Burmistrov --- .4176

Mike Ribeiro --- .4162

Drew Miller --- .4157

Claude Giroux --- .4128

Frans Nielsen --- .4128

Mark Olver --- .4118

Dan Sexton --- .4118

Petr Prucha --- .4114

Brandon Sutter --- .4098

Mathieu Perreault --- .4096

Keaton Ellerby --- .4086

David Krejci --- .4068

Erik Karlsson --- .4057

Pat Dwyer --- .4057

David Van Der Gulik --- .4046

Wayne Simmonds --- .4044

Ryan Shannon --- .4035

Jordan Eberle --- .4023

Oskars Bartulis --- .4022

 

Lowest McBean Ratios (Stocky), Top 25 2010-11

Dustin Byfuglien --- .298

Derek Boogaard --- .3038

Pavel Kubina --- .304

Steve MacIntyre --- .308

Frazer McLaren --- .308

John Scott --- .31

Dustin Penner --- .3102

Sean O'Donnell --- .3122

Douglas Murray --- .3125

Kevin Westgarth --- .3128

Mike Komisarek --- .3128

Brian Boyle --- .3135

Anthony Stewart --- .3149

Matt Greene --- .3165

Raitis Ivanans --- .3167

Matt Smaby --- .3167

Zdeno Chara --- .3176

Andy Sutton --- .3184

Mark Fistric --- .3205

Mike Grier --- .3216

Ben Eager --- .3217

Guillaume Latendresse --- .3217

Ilya Kovalchuk --- .3217

Milan Jurcina --- .322

Erik Johnson --- .322

These lists are interesting, in part because there's a lot of mixed value among the skinny players and a pretty static value among the stouter players.  You have quite a few middling forwards at the skinny end, with a few incredible talents thrown in there, whereas the stout players are almost universally goon- or defensive-types.  It is a bit interesting to see the last few names on the list, though, such as Kovalchuk (Kovalchunk?) and Johnson.  Quite a few of the skinny players are rookies or just young; league-wide, only 27 players were skinnier than True McBean, and only a couple of defensemen, so you have a pretty good idea of where he'd stand today.

 What would be intriguing would be to identify a sort of "critical mass" (literally and figuratively) for how much weight an average NHL player should build up to before not having to worry about lightness compromising their effectiveness.  Of course, talent can trump size in some (rare) cases, and what role a player is filling factors in, but most of us would agree that there is a category of "too skinny for the NHL," where a player will be more effective when they "fill out."  In that same manner, there's likely a "too fat for the NHL" too, and I'm pretty sure Kyle Wellwood's toed that line.

One of the things I'm going to do is track player performance this year with their size in mind, and see where we end up.  I won't reach back because I'm having trouble gaining any confidence on height/weight data from the past.  A lot of that information is adjusted to their updated height and weight.

I'm going to throw together a team version of this later; by the way, I'm not sincerely trying to create a metric called the "McBean Ratio."

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Interesting. Because of how height and weight scale, wouldn’t it be more exact to use inverse BMI (height ^2 / weight) rather than height / weight? Right now all your “fat” guys are really tall.

by Tom Awad on Nov 8, 2010 11:43 AM EST reply actions  

I guess you beat me to it :)

by Jamie Czerwinski on Nov 8, 2010 11:48 AM EST up reply actions  

I thought about BMI, but won’t that still favor taller players?

Bettman's Nightmare: Hypothesizing that Cooper-alls were the Jorts of the 80s.
http://bettmansnightmare.blogspot.com/

You can also catch my work occasionally at www.behindthenethockey.com

by Bettman's Nightmare on Nov 8, 2010 2:02 PM EST up reply actions  

I might consider taking a shot with the Ponderal Index (height^3 / weight) to see where that takes me.

Bettman's Nightmare: Hypothesizing that Cooper-alls were the Jorts of the 80s.
http://bettmansnightmare.blogspot.com/

You can also catch my work occasionally at www.behindthenethockey.com

by Bettman's Nightmare on Nov 8, 2010 2:09 PM EST up reply actions  

oops, I mean (weight / height^3).

Bettman's Nightmare: Hypothesizing that Cooper-alls were the Jorts of the 80s.
http://bettmansnightmare.blogspot.com/

You can also catch my work occasionally at www.behindthenethockey.com

by Bettman's Nightmare on Nov 8, 2010 2:09 PM EST up reply actions  

BMI

Top 10
Byfuglien 22.65098
Kubina 23.104
O’Donnell 23.10549
A.Stewart 23.30213
Bouillon 23.35354
Murray 23.4375
Morris 23.45701
Grier 23.47577
Penner 23.57551
Clutterbuck 23.6666

Bottom 10
Pirri 32.4
Brodie 31.34706
Ekman-Larsson 31.11364
Ellerby 31.05376
D.Miller 30.76404
Bra.Sutter 30.7377
Grabner 30.49412
Ribeiro 29.96532
Simmonds 29.9235
Bartulis 29.76087

Bettman's Nightmare: Hypothesizing that Cooper-alls were the Jorts of the 80s.
http://bettmansnightmare.blogspot.com/

You can also catch my work occasionally at www.behindthenethockey.com

by Bettman's Nightmare on Nov 8, 2010 2:22 PM EST up reply actions  

Wouldn’t this mean that Pirri is obese?

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by maplestirup on Nov 12, 2010 8:35 AM EST up reply actions  

Actually, the opposite

Because I inversed the BMI calculating, so the smaller numbers are “more overweight” bodies and the higher numbers are “more lightweight” bodies. By this and the classic BMI equation agree that Pirri is on the low end of healthy weight at his height (he’s about 11 pounds away from underweight).

Bettman's Nightmare: Hypothesizing that Cooper-alls were the Jorts of the 80s.
http://bettmansnightmare.blogspot.com/

You can also catch my work occasionally at www.behindthenethockey.com

by Bettman's Nightmare on Nov 12, 2010 10:37 AM EST up reply actions  

Ponderal Index

Top 10
Bouillon .0006297
Gerbe .0006191
Tootoo .0005997
Samsonov .0005979
Bergenheim .0005977
Clutterbuck .0005951
Lebda .0005936
Powe .0005923
Morris .0005921
Dawes .0005875

Bottom 10
Ellerby .0004237
Myers .0004277
Pirri .0004287
Bra.Sutter .0004338
Ekman-Larsson .0004343
Brodie .000437
D.Miller .0004393
Anisimov .0004488
Simmonds .0004516
Bartulis .000454

Bettman's Nightmare: Hypothesizing that Cooper-alls were the Jorts of the 80s.
http://bettmansnightmare.blogspot.com/

You can also catch my work occasionally at www.behindthenethockey.com

by Bettman's Nightmare on Nov 8, 2010 2:29 PM EST up reply actions  

It’s amazing how good of a nickname Cube is for Bouillon. Works on so many (well, two) different levels.

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by Bruce Peter on Nov 9, 2010 3:54 PM EST up reply actions  

Agreed. I remember a couple of years ago, my brother and I wanted to find the NHL player that most closely resembles the proportions of a bowling ball, and Bouillon edged out Tootoo. Makes it all the more delightful that they are on the same team now.

Bettman's Nightmare: Hypothesizing that Cooper-alls were the Jorts of the 80s.
http://bettmansnightmare.blogspot.com/

You can also catch my work occasionally at www.behindthenethockey.com

by Bettman's Nightmare on Nov 9, 2010 4:22 PM EST up reply actions  

Why not BMI?

Is there a particular reason you chose not to use BMI as your measure here?

by Jamie Czerwinski on Nov 8, 2010 11:48 AM EST reply actions  

I think I’m a little more interested in the kinetics than the thinness or fatness of the players, truthfully. I’m not so sure that BMI brings me closer to that. Taller players do tend to have more mass to them.

Bettman's Nightmare: Hypothesizing that Cooper-alls were the Jorts of the 80s.
http://bettmansnightmare.blogspot.com/

You can also catch my work occasionally at www.behindthenethockey.com

by Bettman's Nightmare on Nov 8, 2010 2:17 PM EST up reply actions  

Simple Solution

I think a very simple improvement would have been to flip the ratios. Using weight/height makes the “thicker” players have a higher number which I think makes more intuitive sense.

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by bearslb65 on Nov 8, 2010 2:28 PM EST reply actions  

Inverse McBean (haha)

Top 10
Byfuglien 3.3553
Boogaard 3.2911
Kubina 3.2895
MacIntyre 3.2468
McLaren 3.2468
Scott 3.225
Penner 3.2237
O’Donnell 3.2027
Murray 3.2
Westgarth 3.1974

Bottom 10
Pirri 2.2222
Brodie 2.3288
Grabner 2.3611
Ennis 2.3623
Sullivan 2.3676
Ekman-Larsson 2.3784
Burmistrov 2.3944
Ribeiro 2.4028
D.Miller 2.4054
Giroux 2.4225

Bettman's Nightmare: Hypothesizing that Cooper-alls were the Jorts of the 80s.
http://bettmansnightmare.blogspot.com/

You can also catch my work occasionally at www.behindthenethockey.com

by Bettman's Nightmare on Nov 8, 2010 2:35 PM EST up reply actions  

Here’s a thought I’d consider throwing out there: what about figuring hits into the equation? Don’t hits rely on the perception that the hitter has actually affected the play of the hittee? It might be a good contributor to what I suggest in the last paragraph (at what point should a player be considered “filled out”?)

Bettman's Nightmare: Hypothesizing that Cooper-alls were the Jorts of the 80s.
http://bettmansnightmare.blogspot.com/

You can also catch my work occasionally at www.behindthenethockey.com

by Bettman's Nightmare on Nov 8, 2010 2:45 PM EST reply actions  

After reading this I have a sudden urge to play Nintendo Ice Hockey.

by Alex Hemsky on Nov 8, 2010 4:09 PM EST reply actions  

I’m ~180 6’3", not super athletic but athletic enough and I cannot begin to imagine going out onto an NHL rink in the course of play. But I guess if I spent years working with a personal trainer (and had the necessary talent to play in the NHL), maybe I wouldn’t feel that way.

by cajuncook on Nov 8, 2010 4:38 PM EST reply actions  

Although there’s a relatively common opinion ‘round parts of the hockey blogosphere that ’big body presence’ is overrated by various coaches/GMs, it’s certainly helpful to have bulk in a sport with as much contact as hockey. Looking at Brodie, for example (woo, 2nd wispiest player in the NHL!), he was good positionally and put in the effort to defend when he needed to, but it was almost painful sometimes, watching him defend against larger opponents.

by SmellOfVictory on Nov 9, 2010 1:32 AM EST up reply actions  

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